I’m curious to know what everyone thinks about the coming addition
to the economy. I’ve heard snipbits here and there about
it from smelters and some smiths. As of now I don’t even
know how exactly everything will play out but let’s discuss it.
I understand it is nice to have. Not everyone can dedicate a full
boot to play, and it would be awesome to login grab some gear
do a little xping or help a friend grab an item and then
store it and play later w/o wasting too much money.
But then the cycle comes down to buying store bought
gear once a few days grab mud items and store it and
then not have to buy guild/store bought for a while
cuz now you have mud items that you can store to get
again and again over and over… and now smelters
and smiths have inventory that sit forever.
How does everyone else feel? Will your guild make rent?
After some discussion with players a some of us think
that other things need to be changed if/when the vault
option is introduced to balance out the economy.
1, newbie gear has really put a huge hamper on guilds
while it is a great idea, why not stop it sooner than lvl 5?
well, because metals are too heavy for newbie gear.
Can we make low metals lighter? I don’t know? possible.
I think godzilla brought up some interesting ideas on
the vault board. Have it lighter mudwide? have it smith
ability? Make it more equal to items found ingame?
These are just some ideas to get the discussion going.
Everyone please chime in.
there were some great responses on the merc board, but seeing the limits on the mud boards is 50 posts I figure I start the discussion back up on here.
I dont know what changes are in the works.. if any.. last i heard they are waiting for scavenger to save the day.. some how.. but i really only see 2 options.. one.. let smelters make a special metal that amours/weapon smiths can use to add extra damage/ac of a special type.. so i can make a fire helm that gives me resistance to fire.. or a sonic sword.. you get the picture.. or.. redo the WHOLE thing.. because the player base is much smaller maybe just tone down everything.. cost to make items.. amount smelter gets for smelting..
The changes I’ve seen to date are npc items are now ‘used’ when dropped and are of consistent materials as if they would be if produced by a smith. If you find any items say a banded armor made from copper, please make note of it and bug the room.
To be honest, perhaps the only thing that can sort out the smelter issue is a larger player base. More players = more need for armour/weapon guilds to buy stock. The smelter I am in doesn’t cover its weekly rent. Now, that is partly down to me not being about much these days but it’s also down to the demand for stock. We have so much steel sitting there doing nothing. We have had to stop accepting some materials. It seems the only stock being sought after is high stuff like adamantite and platinum. Kinda makes sense - the active players are mainly high level players who need high wc/ac gear. And most newbies are secondaries who get good equip from friends etc.
So what can be done?
Impose a level requirement on items? Make things like blue laen breastplate only useable by level 15+? Make it that the highest armour a level 5 can wear is ac4? A level 10 is ac6 etc? But then you run the risk of newbies dieing more and getting jaded. Dilemma time....
More items that are bound to the player which kills the npc? Just so a player can’t set about equipping a newbie with insane gear.
Get more active players? This is difficult and there have been a variety of recruitment drives. Personally, I don’t know many people who would be into playing MD. Most people have little desire to play any form of game, and those that do like gaming are playing World of Warcraft. This topic would warrant its own separate discussion.
Remove the size from npc descriptions. So a player wants a good breastplate. It used to be that they would have to kill a number of npcs before getting a bplate which was their size. The wrong sized ones would get smelted. Now, a player can skip past all the ‘wrong’ sized npcs to get the one they need.
Allow armour stores to make masks again. Hmm....why did this stop in the first place? Was it Salamanca which sold Hockey Masks on Friday the 13th?
Ability to sell stock to cities (for guard equipment etc.) or the mercantile guild for making wagons?
Not all of these options would be popular, but they could help out a bit. And forgive me if I have made any mistakes - I am rather out of touch with the game these days.
i posted about this in the other thread so i’ll list it briefly here. You need to get a higher value to the player made stuff than npcs drop. Additionally you need to require smelted items elsewhere.
Higher value of player made stuff comes from:
Imbued powers - everything from lighter, more durability, light, darkness, extra damage, etc.
more customization - you have 10 items listed (your standard items) and a mini item machine that pulls from your stockpiles and creates items of customized class and size. This works for both smiths as allows for those character who are not maxxed on str to get the weapons they can wield most efficiently. Same with armor and sizes. It takes away some of the armorsmiths niche market (these guilds for small, those for med, etc) but allows for them to better meet the needs of the people.
Smelted items - A guild wants an extra? they need to get the materials as well as pay for it. A wagon may require wood, leather, and steel. Give the smelted items a use outside of the smiths
Lower encumbrance on armor _ACCORDINGLY_ to level and class.
I like Igor’s idea of selling to cities for NPC guard eq…
I fought to get masks re-instated for YEARS for armor smiths.
What about selling WOOD lots to BARBS for BONFIRES that would last LONGER or almost BELLY-LIKE, with the likes of Rager and co making uber powerful barbs? If not, then make the barbs hit harder and MORE than any other class...being naturally ambi, nobody should even come close to melee cept maybe fighter.
Get rid of the mage spell PROTECT. (Even this, I tried to get rid of for years now.)
Get rid of the druid spell REGROWTH, or put limitations on this spell.
I step off this stupid ass soap box and await all your tomatoes—er, replies.
Druids don’t need any nerfing, kthx. I will say that purify was tweaked so that it no longer brings broken items back from the dead. But I’m not sure that played much of a role in in the metals market
Heh, never thought about getting rid of the protect spell.
But then, if that is removed then it could be argued that barbs should lose their leathercraft patch skill. Hmm....or maybe barbs could buy leather from smelters to use for their leathercraft skills?
The vault: obviously a lot of code has gone into it, but I think for the sake of guilds it should be removed. For necros, maybe a corpse vault could be added to the necro guild?
I quite like Gogo’s idea about a mini-item machine for armour and weapon guilds, but perhaps it should make standard weapons only. I have a low level cleric and no stores stock lower level 2h clubs. Having a chance to get a weapon I can use from a guild would make it easier for, and encourage, me to play.
only problem with getting rid of protect it will hamper the real use of it, protecting items that you dont buy, and are one a boot.. or random and might not see the rest of the boot.
At present, newbies get free gear from Galen until they get to level 5 (I think - it’s been a while).
How about, they get free gear at level 1 only?
Then at level 2 Galen will present them with a ‘coupon’ (ok, so the details are a bit sketchy, but bear with me) which stays in the newbie’s inventory for that boot and entitles the newbie to buy equipment from armour/weapon guilds at a reduction - say 50%.
At level 3 the reduction would be 25%, at level 4 10%.
By level 4, the player should be getting the hang of the game and should be able to work out how the economy works. By level 5 they are big enough and ugly enough to fend for themselves. It helps guilds attract customers at an early stage, getting them into the habit of buying store-bought gear. It also helps smelters as there is more of a need for lower materials.
Some problems though:
- it would be unfair on stores outside Vesla as players would get used to shopping at Vesla stores;
- need to watch for a newbie using the discount to buy high level gear for friends;
- to avoid stores losing out on profits, they actually receive the full cost of the item - the player pays their share, the rest will come from the Adventurer Guild or something…
only problem with getting rid of protect it will hamper the real use of it, protecting items that you dont buy, and are one a boot.. or random and might not see the rest of the boot.
For someone who has survived through countless versions of MD, I find it hard to believe you would say such a thing. Ambush took a lot more skill in managing your drunkeness less you snap thy weapon in half.
As far as fighters go, Im sure wizards would tweak the longevity of items (both weapons and armor) were protect to be taken out of the game.
And besides...there are services offered throughout the realms which can repair or fix items…
Surely one as MD veteran-saavy as yourself can figure it out, or know such already.
only problem with getting rid of protect it will hamper the real use of it, protecting items that you dont buy, and are one a boot.. or random and might not see the rest of the boot.
For someone who has survived through countless versions of MD, I find it hard to believe you would say such a thing. Ambush took a lot more skill in managing your drunkeness less you snap thy weapon in half.
As far as fighters go, Im sure wizards would tweak the longevity of items (both weapons and armor) were protect to be taken out of the game.
And besides...there are services offered throughout the realms which can repair or fix items…
Surely one as MD veteran-saavy as yourself can figure it out, or know such already.
You are a true 49er fan, arent you?
Alithras
Yes i know these things, and a Niner fan.. but i just dont see how protect is hurting the economy to the point it needs to be taken out. the only thing it really effects is barbs and monks for the most part.. which would help use some of that cloth out there.
I still say the guild system needs to be tailored to the smaller player base. I dont know the numbers for it all, but I have tracked most of EW’s numbers for the last couple of years.
And I agree with vault, take it out, or limit it to 1-2 items, but let them be stored for longer. While the vault is nice, and when i play every day or every other day, i only have to buy a couple pieces of equipment to get rollin. Which is very nice, and the reason its there, but it does hurt a already struggling economy.
